Did Sakamoto make Samus' Suit perform worse on purpose?

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TheAccursedHunter01

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Did Sakamoto make Samus' Suit perform worse on purpose?

Postby TheAccursedHunter01 » 07.14.13 12:38am

I have noticed multiple points where Samus in Other M performs at a much lower level than she used to in nearly every game prior. For example, when you are Speed Boosting in any other Metroid game, you are a blue blur of death. Nothing can stop you except and indestructible wall. In Other M, however, there are certain enemies and obstacles that can knock you out of it no problem. The puffers of any kind will knock you out by colliding with them, certain drones that project a "laser wall" will knock you out of it if you collide with the "wall" as well unless you shoot the drones before hand. The Shinespark has been downgraded to a REALLY long jump, instead of being able to store the charge and shoot yourself in whatever direction you are able, or keep the charge and maneuver yourself into a position where you can shoot yourself for a very long distance. Let's not forget that there are a large number of obstacles that are put in your way ON PURPOSE so that you cannot Speed Boost all over the place. Then again, if your Speed Boost wasn't gimped, you'd be overpowered early, so I guess it makes some sense.

On this topic though, sometimes there is an invisible pixel that apparently collides with you and your Speed Boost charge is cancelled. Best example I can think of is the giant spiral ramp in the beginning of Sector 1. If you're too close to the inside of the ramp you won't build up SB anyway. If you fire a charge shot during the Speed Booster, you will fly back due to recoil and you'll cancel out the Speed Boost. The Charge Shot has never made Samus get knocked back, especially to the absurd length that it does in Other M. Speaking of which, the Super Missile does the same thing. She can rapid fire them(although not quite as fast as the regular missiles) and they do not sent her backward in any game prior. The Space Jump only lets Samus keep her current height instead of being able to jump infinitely(duh), with this Space Jump and gimped Shinespark however, you can no longer Speed Boost and then Space Jump infinitely over a large distance as a blue buzz saw of destruction. The Screwattack does not kill all regular enemies in one hit like in all the 2D games, and it took three hits maximum in the Prime games. It can take more than five hits for some enemies. Though, in the Prime games it was nothing more than a way to travel long distances, but I digress. Last, but certainly not least, the amount of collectibles you acquire. 9 Energy Tanks, 80 Missiles, 3 E-Recovery Tanks, 16 Energy Part which is a waste of a collectible in a Metroid game if I ever saw one, and 6 Accel Charges. The Accel Charges can stay because they change the charge beam time from the 2-3 seconds in the Prime games to a little less than 1 second which is about as fast if not faster than the 2D games.

I'm not sure why this is, but it seems like someone somewhere tried to make Samus weaker. The amount of collectibles I can understand since the Bottle Ship is fairly small, though 1 missile per tank is REALLY disappointing. Why was this done? Seriously, who out there wanted to make Samus weaker? This is what I've found in my......four times playing through the game. I consider this my guilty pleasure because it IS fun to play through......especially if you skip/riff on the cutscenes. What do the rest of you think about this? Anything I missed or anything you all want to add?

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Re: Did Sakamoto make Samus' Suit perform worse on purpose?

Postby TheBlackCat » 07.14.13 3:24am

I think it was probably done somewhat for balance. For one thing, allowing Samus to jump an infinite distance in any direction would have both been hard to control with the controller set-up, and would have made level design much harder. Similarly, restricting the number of missiles Samus gets helps balance her strength when she has her recovery ability and finisher moves. It also requires more strategy, especially with the speed booster.

You also need to remember that these creatures were intentionally designed as bio-weapons, so it isn't too surprising they are more able to deal with advanced technological weapons than the natives of Zebes.
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Re: Did Sakamoto make Samus' Suit perform worse on purpose?

Postby Xerkxes » 07.23.13 12:23am

Actually, she's considerably stronger than she is in the primes.

Faster, jumps higher, Space jump isn't as limited in multiple ways (which she can jump infinitely, and actually it DOES act as a double jump for height reasons, it simply doesn't scale higher than the second jump)

and then for Firepower.. save for Hyper mode.. she's almost never had as much firepower.

Charge shots get super powerful, Super missiles have never had such a big blast and the seeker missile system is more streamlined (and powerful, since it includes a super missile), power bombs have never had such a violently big blast before

She's even seen literally kicking the shit out of some creatures or knocking down the big ones without resorting to weapons till she has them on the ground, if she isn't tossing them around like ragdolls (which in some cases she REALLY does, like the oversized camelions or the lizards that dig through the ground)

The reason her missile count was watered down was because of the concentration ability, she effectively had infinite missiles (which I actually find is better than how it was in past games.. since whenever you needed missiles they practically gave them too you anyway), so the typical 200+ missiles became... rather much. this actually added difficulty in Hard mode, since if you needed missiles you'd have to stop fighting to recharge, which you don't get missiles if you get hit before it's done.

It's actually probably the more powerful she's ever been, but they just tweaked things.
like they didn't bother with a wide beam like weapon due to the auto aim feature.

It's really just her movement that's gotten watered down, but it isn't anywhere near as "bad" as she was in the primes.
Xerkxes: "Makes you wonder why Samus just didn't take one of the Crystals with her, and constantly charge it with the light beam while using it as a God damned +5 Brilliant Energy Spear of Smite-Ing "

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Re: Did Sakamoto make Samus' Suit perform worse on purpose?

Postby Emperor Ing » 07.23.13 5:04pm

Those things would sound appealing if Other M was any fun to actually play.
must be some sorta side effect of the hatchling or maybe she should stop going down on Miyamoto.
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Re: Did Sakamoto make Samus' Suit perform worse on purpose?

Postby metroidsuperfan11 » 05.25.14 10:20pm

yeah what they say is true she is more powerful her movement is downgraded but think about this in super metroid once you upgraded from shotgun beam (spazer) to almighty death beam (plasma) you pretty much 1 almost everything if you just add charge and minus ice all of these enemies are taken from their native homes and trained to be living weapons AKA bio weapons some of them were even able to withstand gravity that is immensly stronger then earth let's just say 10x to 30x that of earth maybe even stronger also they have gained an intellengence boost weather the grub mass was able to do what it did natually is unknown but they did seem to get the idea extremely quick also other enemies have gained higher intellegence as well I mean yes samus is very strong by the end but so are the enemies ... stronger then ever before oh and one more thing some of these creatures genes have been messed with for example the creature that resembles the morphball boss in fusion there is a harder version of this thing later on in other m it pretrudes longer spikes and can brush one or two charged plasma it could either be a natural evelution just accelecrated or it might be a mutated monster that wanted no part in whatever happened to it

so to recap still strong lesser movement enemies stronger some can withstand higher gravity intellengece boost and mutations or acceleration of nature you decide


also yes I know one of you above said bio-weapons I was just going more in depth

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Re: Did Sakamoto make Samus' Suit perform worse on purpose?

Postby Xerkxes » 05.26.14 7:31pm

yeah what they say is true she is more powerful her movement is downgraded but think about this in super metroid once you upgraded from shotgun beam (spazer) to almighty death beam (plasma) you pretty much 1 almost everything if you just add charge and minus ice all of these enemies are taken from their native homes and trained to be living weapons AKA bio weapons some of them were even able to withstand gravity that is immensly stronger then earth let's just say 10x to 30x that of earth maybe even stronger also they have gained an intellengence boost weather the grub mass was able to do what it did natually is unknown but they did seem to get the idea extremely quick also other enemies have gained higher intellegence as well I mean yes samus is very strong by the end but so are the enemies ... stronger then ever before oh and one more thing some of these creatures genes have been messed with for example the creature that resembles the morphball boss in fusion there is a harder version of this thing later on in other m it pretrudes longer spikes and can brush one or two charged plasma it could either be a natural evelution just accelecrated or it might be a mutated monster that wanted no part in whatever happened to it

so to recap still strong lesser movement enemies stronger some can withstand higher gravity intellengece boost and mutations or acceleration of nature you decide


also yes I know one of you above said bio-weapons I was just going more in depth
Only movement abilities really got watered down, otherwise she the most agile she's ever been with her high level acrobatic evasion, and probably highest base running speed she's ever had (and the morphall was faster too. Not to mention the slick and seemless transition). Otherwise he movement abilites are somewhere in between Prime and 2D game for comparison.

The loss of the Spazer/Wide beam is made up for by two factors; auto aim and Diffusion beam.
Auto Aim is self evident, but the Diffusion beam shoots out lobs of energy as big as she is and explode on contact, 2D Samus only ever had one AoE weapon and that was power bombs (even her missiles liked blast radius), the Plasma beam could cause the Diffusion beam to detonate multiple times, making it rather insane in close quarters or in grouped enemies, not to mention the faster charge rate, higher rate of fire of the normal shots, and greatly increased muzzle velocity.
Xerkxes: "Makes you wonder why Samus just didn't take one of the Crystals with her, and constantly charge it with the light beam while using it as a God damned +5 Brilliant Energy Spear of Smite-Ing "

metroidsuperfan11

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Re: Did Sakamoto make Samus' Suit perform worse on purpose?

Postby metroidsuperfan11 » 05.29.14 6:47pm

yeah what they say is true she is more powerful her movement is downgraded but think about this in super metroid once you upgraded from shotgun beam (spazer) to almighty death beam (plasma) you pretty much 1 almost everything if you just add charge and minus ice all of these enemies are taken from their native homes and trained to be living weapons AKA bio weapons some of them were even able to withstand gravity that is immensly stronger then earth let's just say 10x to 30x that of earth maybe even stronger also they have gained an intellengence boost weather the grub mass was able to do what it did natually is unknown but they did seem to get the idea extremely quick also other enemies have gained higher intellegence as well I mean yes samus is very strong by the end but so are the enemies ... stronger then ever before oh and one more thing some of these creatures genes have been messed with for example the creature that resembles the morphball boss in fusion there is a harder version of this thing later on in other m it pretrudes longer spikes and can brush one or two charged plasma it could either be a natural evelution just accelecrated or it might be a mutated monster that wanted no part in whatever happened to it

so to recap still strong lesser movement enemies stronger some can withstand higher gravity intellengece boost and mutations or acceleration of nature you decide


also yes I know one of you above said bio-weapons I was just going more in depth
Only movement abilities really got watered down, otherwise she the most agile she's ever been with her high level acrobatic evasion, and probably highest base running speed she's ever had (and the morphall was faster too. Not to mention the slick and seemless transition). Otherwise he movement abilites are somewhere in between Prime and 2D game for comparison.

The loss of the Spazer/Wide beam is made up for by two factors; auto aim and Diffusion beam.
Auto Aim is self evident, but the Diffusion beam shoots out lobs of energy as big as she is and explode on contact, 2D Samus only ever had one AoE weapon and that was power bombs (even her missiles liked blast radius), the Plasma beam could cause the Diffusion beam to detonate multiple times, making it rather insane in close quarters or in grouped enemies, not to mention the faster charge rate, higher rate of fire of the normal shots, and greatly increased muzzle velocity.
yes this very true as well ..... to bad the shinespark kind of suffered ....... actually suffered immensly I really wish it wasn't as weak I think the real reason behind it is if they tried to capture the massive speed that it had in super metoid then the system might have a good chance of crashing because of the 3D enviorment and the fact that even if a few enemies were on screen it still lagged if it tired to process the speed of super it would most likely crash as for the shinespark ....... lack of buttons I think

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Re: Did Sakamoto make Samus' Suit perform worse on purpose?

Postby Doc Scratch » 06.23.14 10:23pm

Those things would sound appealing if Other M was any fun to actually play.
That's the rub, isn't it?

For all the hubbub some people make about Samus being "agile" in Other M, that agility is automated and scripted. You don't dodge an attack with timing and positioning, you dodge with a canned invincible animation that looks cool but plays dumb. You don't input a complicated combo to make Samus finish off an enemy at close-quarters, you just press a button. You don't use the shinespark to blast over and through gaps, you use it when the level design lets you and no more.

And really, that's one of the main things Other M doesn't understand on a fundamental level: Player control. Every other Metroid game understood that, even Fusion and Prime 3.
Suckers.

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Re: Did Sakamoto make Samus' Suit perform worse on purpose?

Postby Xerkxes » 06.24.14 12:01am

Those things would sound appealing if Other M was any fun to actually play.
That's the rub, isn't it?

For all the hubbub some people make about Samus being "agile" in Other M, that agility is automated and scripted. You don't dodge an attack with timing and positioning, you dodge with a canned invincible animation that looks cool but plays dumb. You don't input a complicated combo to make Samus finish off an enemy at close-quarters, you just press a button. You don't use the shinespark to blast over and through gaps, you use it when the level design lets you and no more.

And really, that's one of the main things Other M doesn't understand on a fundamental level: Player control. Every other Metroid game understood that, even Fusion and Prime 3.
The Dodge isn't entirely invincible, some bosses can ignore it if you dodge into attacks, but you still have a point.

Hafta agree, however given the controller restrictions, there wasn't much the developers could do unless they just didn't bother with "trying" to make her agile.

Not to mention the Auto-Aim and "Rails", the game felt liked it played itself.
Xerkxes: "Makes you wonder why Samus just didn't take one of the Crystals with her, and constantly charge it with the light beam while using it as a God damned +5 Brilliant Energy Spear of Smite-Ing "

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Re: Did Sakamoto make Samus' Suit perform worse on purpose?

Postby Rustedsoda » 06.24.14 11:20am

Actually that could be. It wouldn't surprise me if Samus is intended to be affected on multiple levels throughout the game. It is clear she isn't herself.
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