Create a Metroid Upgrade

[Thunderchin]

Suppose that, when you got a new Beam, it wasn't really a Beam so much as it was equipment to modify the effects of an existing weapon?

..the effects of an existing WEAPON?

(Emphasis added.)

I did not say Beam. I said WEAPON. Aren't Missiles a weapon too? I say, extend stacking beams to the Missiles. Fusion was a great start, with Super, Ice and Diffusion Missiles stacking atop the normal ones. But I want to take it further.

So far, we've seen (in stacking fashion) the Wave, Ice, Spazer, Plasma, Charge, Super, and Diffusion upgrades. (That list combines Missile and Beam upgrades.) What if any stacking upgrade could be applied to any weapon? To this end...

Stacking Missiles: Allows stackable weapons upgrades to be applied to the Missiles. Since there are seven total stacking upgrades available, the Beam can take four upgrades and the Missiles three. Individual stacking upgrades cannot be applied to both the Beam and Missiles at once.

Normal Beam: 20 damage, no special properties.
Normal Missiles: 60 damage, ammo requirement (ammo expansions exist)

Wave: 100% increase in weapon power (read: adds 20 damage to Beam and 60 to Missile), shot passes through walls.
Ice: 50% increase in weapon power. Freezes on last shot before kill shot (Beam Only). Freezes on first hit (Missile Only).
Spazer: 300% increase in weapon power. Shot is split into three, each one equivalent in power to one single shot. (This only consumes 1 Ammo though if used with Missiles.) Each shot is independent of the other two.
Plasma: 400% increase in weapon power. Pierces enemies and continues on (Beam Only).
Charge: 500% increase in weapon power when charged. Hold fire button to charge up a concentrated blast. Consumes 5 Ammo (Missiles Only). Incompatible with Diffusion.
Diffusion: No increase in weapon power when charged. Hold fire button to fire an explosive blast, covers an entire area with the effects of the weapon. Incompatible with Charge.
Super: 500% increase in weapon power.

I think this, combined with Remnants' Beam Reserve idea, would make a totally kick-ass weapon management system. *get's to work on Beam Reserve combination idea*

Also, Henshin Device: viewtopic.php?f=18&t=4842&start=16

[Zeroº]

I proposed a similar, yet much more basic and less...numbery...idea over in the "Metroid on the Wii U" topic. It's a decent idea, though.
I personally never thought of Metroid as a numbers game so much as an attributes game (that was the main focus of Fusion, what with the constant enhancing of the Missiles and desire for the Plasma and Ice Beams), so the numbers (other than Missile ammo count) tend to get lost on me. Metroid was always (and still sort of is) about which beam kills what better, or just hit 'em with loads of missiles 'til they die, with the stacking nature of the beams letting them spread their attributes across the board. Though, my idea would have spread the attributes to nearly all of the equipment in Samus' arsenal as needed.

Imagine: Plugging the Plasma Beam into the Screw Attack, Space Jump, or Speedbooster module for the ability to melt your way through a tunnel of ice or frozen lake.
Imagine: Plugging the Wave Beam into the Gravity Suit for a very temporary out-of-phase mode for dodging incoming attacks or passing through an otherwise impassable wall or door.
Imagine: Plugging the Ice Beam into the Power Bombs for a one-off Freeze Bomb.
Imagine: Plugging the Diffusion Beam into the Screw Attack for a larger radius of destruction around Samus whenever it connects with an enemy.

[Thunderchin]

Imagine: Plugging the Plasma Beam into the Screw Attack, Space Jump, or Speedbooster module for the ability to melt your way through a tunnel of ice or frozen lake.
Imagine: Plugging the Wave Beam into the Gravity Suit for a very temporary out-of-phase mode for dodging incoming attacks or passing through an otherwise impassable wall or door.
Imagine: Plugging the Ice Beam into the Power Bombs for a one-off Freeze Bomb.
Imagine: Plugging the Diffusion Beam into the Screw Attack for a larger radius of destruction around Samus whenever it connects with an enemy.

I added numbers just to give an idea of what each one did...I don't care 'bout numbers either. Also, I was playing around with combining those attributes with other items. (Great minds DO think alike!) But, I eventually figured it'd just be too cumbersome and complex, and would get in the way more than it would help.

One more thing, and I forgot to mention this, but this system would work in 2D best. Especially if it were on the DS, in which case we could simply control Beam and Missile attributes by a few thumb taps in real time. Hell, with a touch screen, we could do a LOT with the Beam Reserve and Attribute Switching System (BRASS), where we could divert some of that BR into Samus' shield and switch desired attributes into the Missiles for instance.

[Zeroº]

Yeah, my idea was for you to have a Systems Screen on, say, the UMoteScreen, with a selection of Equipment and Beams. There would also be an Essence pool. Essence would be the life-force collected from a dead enemy, much like the Energy and Missile pickups of yore, only it would be an attribute. You could have Poison, Water, Plant, Fire, Stone, Time, Light, Dark, Wind, Speed, Weight, and other more science-y stuff. You would have the standard beams, Missiles, and Bombs (as you collect them, of course), but you could "plug" or "merge" (pick a pet name) them all together with the attributes and other suit functions/upgrades to a limited degree.

Like you said, it would get rather...cumbersome pretty fast. Giving that much freedom, and those many options, to the average player would likely be daunting at best. Not to mention that proper utilization of the system would likely break the balance to an unhealthy degree (but think of the user-generated levels that could be made with a system like this in mind). That's why I figured that only a few of the combos would be mandatory for actual game progress, and all the others would simply be for making things easier/finding some crazy-elusive expansions.

An important element of balance would be to give these Essences a limitation system. My first thought would be a basic ammo counter. I don't like that, so let's go with something more RPG-y. How about this:
Samus kills a clockwork robot/cyborg-thingy with the ability to slow down local time/space.
Samus uses her suit's newfound ability to absorb the Time Essence it leaves behind (probably by using Concentrate where she killed the thing [you'd see a colored mist/cloud]).
Once absorbed, that Time Essence adds to the Time gauge.
Collect enough Time Essence to fill the Time gauge and Samus unlocks unlimited use of the Time Essence with a bit of a power boost.
Until then, every time Samus uses the Time Essence for any ability or shot fired, the quantity in the gauge decreases.

A system like that would limit the use of the potentially-overpowered Essences until the end of the game where there would likely be enemies that leave behind large amounts of Essence (and possibly more than one type) upon death. While it wouldn't stop people like me from hording and "cementing" (making them permanent) the Essences, it would definitely kill your final time.

And the best Essence would have to go to the Metroids. Life regeneration by sucking it out of any non-cold (non-ice-based) enemy when attached to the Grapple Beam. A tightly-controlled hover when attached to the Space Jump, except in cold areas. Nearly-impenetrable armour when attached to any of the suits, except for in cold areas where the defense will be lowered. A Hyper Beam-like override for all the beams at the expense of Energy for every shot fired (unless cemented). Homing Missiles when attached to Missiles, only they are non-discriminatory and will aim for the nearest energy-producing thing that isn't Samus.

You could plug the Plasma Beam into the Missiles for a big, superheated, blunt projectile that doesn't explode, but causes blunt-force trauma in conjunction with some nasty heat effects. Basically used for punching holes into walls and heavily-armoured things.
You could plug the Light Essence into the Power Suit to create a glow that helps you see in a pitch-black area.
You could plug the Ice Beam into the Speedbooster to allow you run over the top of a body of water.
You could plug the Spider Ball into any of the suits in order to walk on almost any wall or ceiling.
You could plug the Darkness Essence into any of the suits to turn almost-to-completely invisible (depends on if you cemented it and/or if Samus is standing still).
There are just so many potentially awesome combinations with a system like that...

[Thunderchin]

Yes, your combinations are awesome, but you're making it more complicated than it needs to be.

[simplify="Zero's Idea"]

First, ammo counters worked in Metroid Prime 2: Echoes for Dark, Light, and Annihilator Beams. Why not expand that ammo system?

Second, why so many of those essences? In an Essence system, you would only need the basic elements. If that's not enough for your task, combine elements!
Going with the elements and nothing else nets you six. I'm sure Fire, Ice, Air, Earth, Dark and Light are more than enough to complete your mission, and still have quite a few uniquely-solved, crazy-elusive powerups.

Also, as I imagine it, you don't plug essences into individual powerups, you plug 'em into an area of the suit. You have your Boots, your Morph Ball, your Visor, your Suit as a whole, and of course your Beam and Missiles. Each area can only have one Essence tacked on, so choose wisely.

Say, Dark attached to the Suit would make you a mirage, but at some expense to your shielding. Every time you took damage, that ammo counter would drop, and if you ran out the effect would wear off. Light would illuminate dark areas, but only for a certain radius, plus that light coming off you would be, essentially, a beacon for enemies to "shoot here". Then of course plugging Water into the Suit would make the Gravity Suit. And so on.

Attaching Fire to your Boots would leave a fire trail behind you (consuming Fire Ammo in the process) when Speed Boosting, and turn your Screw Attack into a whirling vortex of flames.

Attaching Ground to your Visor would allow you to echolocate (again, burning Ammo) and use tunneling sonar to detect enemies coming from all sides. Attaching Air to your Visor would allow you to visualize air currents (say, for solving puzzles) and take note of them.

Plugging Ice into your Morph Ball would freeze any liquid it rolled over (consuming Ammo doing so) and enable your precious Freeze Bombs.

And so on. Plus, why use a "cement" system when you can add Beam Reserve to the mix and have it auto-regenerate when not in use?

[/simplify]

[Zeroº]

I would prefer the "cementing" system because it would culminate to Samus being a flat-out bad-ass at the end of the game with all of her abilities unlocked, like with every other Metroid game. Plus, it would lead to a sense of accomplishment when you are able to unlock an Essence's unlimited use. (And each unlock would lead to a % or two on your completion rate. )

[Thunderchin]

I would prefer the "cementing" system because it would culminate to Samus being a flat-out bad-ass at the end of the game with all of her abilities unlocked, like with every other Metroid game. Plus, it would lead to a sense of accomplishment when you are able to unlock an Essence's unlimited use. (And each unlock would lead to a % or two on your completion rate. )

That makes MUCH more sense. I admit I was wrong about ammo. (I'm trying to avoid RPG elements as much as possible. RPG to me equals a numbers game. And you already said earlier you didn't want a numbers game.)

I still maintain my argument about amount of Essence types. Keep it to the elements.

Aside from that, I still have my doubts as to how it would play out.

[Zeroº]

I wouldn't want the Essence gauge to represented by a number system, thus the whole "gauge" thing. Sure, it would have a current number count vs. number goal, but that would be behind the scenes and the user would only see a visual representation of the current amount of Essence in possession. The goal for each Essence would be the same amount across the board, but each Essence would have a level of rarity(possibly with some being completely miss-able or hard to find). My comment about the numbers game earlier was more in reference to the number counts of the damage increase. They just seem so...arbitrary...in a game like Metroid. Sure, they had a system in place in Fusion in which the beams and Missiles constantly switched places in terms of who's stronger, but they avoided the technical terms other than "The Super Missile is 3x times stronger than the average Missile."

And I guess we are a bit at odds, because while I would try to avoid a blatant ammo system for everything but the Missiles (and Power Bombs, but I liked Other M's system), I don't mind the RPG elements quite so much (I dare say that it might be my favorite genre). Have you ever played any of the GBA Castlevania games? I guess you could say that they are something of an inspiration for this idea. Collect the souls, use 'em how ya want.

My reasoning for the "plugging" or "merging" of abilities into each other was that each ability was at one point Essence collected from the corpse of something. I use Fusion as my reasoning behind this. Nightmare = Gravity Suit, Yakuza = Space Jump, Ridley-X = Screw Attack, Serris = Speedbooster, etc. Kind of like how the Spider Ball would be of the Magnetic Essence. Or how the Space Jump would be of the Anti-Gravity Essence. This would mean that each standard ability would have an Essence that could be fused with another ability or beam. Emphasis on the "could." Not everything would be compatible. But my main idea was for the Essences to be applied to individual suit parts. It's a big ol' complex system of combinations and whatnot.

And, yeah, I would say to limit the amount of Essence types, but not by too much. I would definitely want some frivolous Essences just for the sheer Hell of it (call it a harking back to the old days of gaming), because some combinations could make for some surprising usefulness for the more intrepid combiners. Add Plant Essence to the Plasma Beam for a Napalm-like effect. Or add the Light Essence to the Missiles for Guided Missiles, each one controllable by the player. Take the Water Essence (mostly useless), combine it with the Poison Essence (mostly useless), and plug it into the Power Suit to create a poison fog that is slowly emitted from Samus' suit (very useful during boss fights and in tight quarters).

Each Essence would also eat away at their respective gauge in a different way. Some would take a chunk out per use (e.i. shots fired, jumps made, distance run), while others would eat it up per amount of damage taken or for the amount of time their are activated.

Cumbersome? Yes.
Full of possibility? Yes.
Complicated? Only at first. Metroid is something of a puzzle game, after all.

Add Plant Essence to the Bomb to create a temporary mini, plant platform upon detonation, making bomb-jumping a lot easier.
Add Plant Essence to the Power Suit to create a weakness to extreme heat/fire, but gain the respect of the nearly plants, causing them to attack enemies that get too close to you and to open previously-blocked paths.

[Dekutulla]

The Dehydration Beam

Causes targets subjected to the beam to rapidly lose internal moisture, essentially turning them into shriveled husks.

When fired on liquid enough, causes it to dry up.

Cannot work on frozen substances.

Color: Sandy Yellow. Charged attack: Instantaneous dehydration of whatever it hits. Charge Combo: Fires a super charged form of the beam, followed by 5 missiles, which destroy whatever it was. Useful for destroying large trees.

I dunno.

[Thunderchin]

Crowbar: Gives Samus a reliable close-quarters weapon. In addition to being able to pry open malfunctioning doors, beat up creatures that get too close, and demolish obstacles, it was specially modified to be compatible with the Grapple Beam system. Latch onto the Crowbar with the Grapple Beam and...voila! Grappling hook, useful for snaring enemies and ripping them apart from medium distance!

Troid Upgrades: (Apologies to our user, Troid.) If Samus keeps her Fusion Suit and Metroid vaccine post-Fusion, she should have some sort of way of taking advantage of the Metroids' life-leaching abilities using Suit upgrades.

-Troid Grip: Gives the Power Grip a boost, allowing Samus to grip everything from creatures to enemies to power lines and draw energy from them. This goes into Samus' Energy reserves.

-Troid Grapple: Gives the Grapple Voltage a boost. Now, the Grapple Voltage is no longer limited to just electrical power, but can also be used on life forms to leach the Energy out of them. (And, again, dump it in her own Energy reserves.) Like the Grapple Voltage of yore, this also works both ways; Samus can, just like the Baby Metroid before her, lend her own energy to other creatures.

-Troid Blast: Samus' Overblast gets a considerable boost. Now, when Samus leaps atop enemies, she can initiate a direct Energy siphon. This siphon is rather slow, and enemies can throw Samus off, but when done properly Samus will have just destroyed yet another enemy.

SPARTAN Suit, Mk. 6: Gives Samus regenerating Health, adds 60% damage reduction, adds a wrist-mounted Energy Sword to the left arm, and makes the suit take on a green color.

[Dekutulla]

Crowbar: Gives Samus a reliable close-quarters weapon. In addition to being able to pry open malfunctioning doors, beat up creatures that get too close, and demolish obstacles

Well, I don't think that would work that well for use number 1. Just look how well it worked for Gordon Freeman. All he could do with it was break wood. Even crates, which you should be able to open with a crowbar WITHOUT just hitting it over and over.

[doc O. Mire]

Narpas Sword: a giant, curved blade that materializes in Samus' left hand, allowing her to combine her deadly ranged attacks with vicious sword techniques. It can also be attached to the grapple beam or used with the power grip so you always have a surface to grab onto once the sword embeds itself in the wall/ceiling

Warning: extended use of the narpas sword may cause a drain of power that makes powersuits deactivate for vaguely established reasons

[Dragonheart91]

Some of the abilities I've considered:

-Obviously beam effects on missiles is a neat idea.
-A beam-stacking item that you had to collect to allow Samus to stack more beams. (Each expansion allowed one more beam to be stacked.)
-Elemental upgrades to bombs. For example, Fire Bombs which would melt ice and would send a small trail of fire out to the left and right of the bomb explosion for a short distance. (Similar to the weapon used by the B.O.X. boss in Fusion.)
-Morph Ball upgrade for underwater mobility. (Unnamed) Basically, it gives the morph ball neutral buoyancy and adds a propeller to allow underwater mobility in morph ball mode. You can swim in morph ball now.
-New beam that bounces.
-New beam that refracts making two more beams when it hits a wall/enemy (not sure which would be more appropriate).
-Speed booster allows running on top of water.
-Grapple Whip upgrade which allows attacks with the Grapple Lasso. Basically, it enables the ability to grab enemies and some melee attacks. The enemy grabbing would be similar to the prime games although possibly also allowing you to pull them in closer. The melee attacks would be like a low damage whip attack at mid-range that knocks enemies away. You could get all kinds of creative with using the Grapple Lasso as a whip type weapon.
-Ice Bombs which have a slightly larger explosion radius, freeze effected enemies temporarily (less time than missiles or beam), and also freeze water in the explosion radius.
-Traction Boots. These stop Samus from slipping on ice, allow speed boosting on ice, and allow wall-jumping and/or wall-sliding.

That's probably enough for now.

[Thunderchin]

Some of the abilities I've considered:

-Obviously beam effects on missiles is a neat idea.
-A beam-stacking item that you had to collect to allow Samus to stack more beams. (Each expansion allowed one more beam to be stacked.)
-Elemental upgrades to bombs. For example, Fire Bombs which would melt ice and would send a small trail of fire out to the left and right of the bomb explosion for a short distance. (Similar to the weapon used by the B.O.X. boss in Fusion.)
-Morph Ball upgrade for underwater mobility. (Unnamed) Basically, it gives the morph ball neutral buoyancy and adds a propeller to allow underwater mobility in morph ball mode. You can swim in morph ball now.
-New beam that bounces.
-New beam that refracts making two more beams when it hits a wall/enemy (not sure which would be more appropriate).
-Speed booster allows running on top of water.
-Grapple Whip upgrade which allows attacks with the Grapple Lasso. Basically, it enables the ability to grab enemies and some melee attacks. The enemy grabbing would be similar to the prime games although possibly also allowing you to pull them in closer. The melee attacks would be like a low damage whip attack at mid-range that knocks enemies away. You could get all kinds of creative with using the Grapple Lasso as a whip type weapon.
-Ice Bombs which have a slightly larger explosion radius, freeze effected enemies temporarily (less time than missiles or beam), and also freeze water in the explosion radius.
-Traction Boots. These stop Samus from slipping on ice, allow speed boosting on ice, and allow wall-jumping and/or wall-sliding.

That's probably enough for now.

With the exceptions of "Bounce Beam" and "Refraction Beam", I like 'em all. Good thinking, mate!

-Morph Ball upgrade for underwater mobility. (Unnamed) Basically, it gives the morph ball neutral buoyancy and adds a propeller to allow underwater mobility in morph ball mode. You can swim in morph ball now.

Ummm...Buoy Ball? I've considered something similar for "normal" mode...

[Varia Suit]

Game Beam: If the game detects the original Metroid, M2, or any other Metroid game that has been put on WiiWare or the 3DS shop, DSi Ware ect.if it is on your system, then charge up your beam, select a power bomb, then go in to morph ball, Samus will turn into 1 of 3 random designs from M1 to super, Your beam will become Minecraft style and it packs 5x the damage for a measly price of 1 Power bomb and a couple of bucks!